|
|
Post by reefwood on Feb 28, 2014 20:41:35 GMT -5
Another thing I want to double check on is primary and secondary attacks in relation to standard attacks and full round attacks. If a creature has multiple primary attacks they can claw, claw, bite (all primary) they can use those on a standard attack and on a full attack they can use all primary and secondary (claw, claw, bite, tail)? And just a general FYI. I'm looking towards a quadruped with claws, rake, pounce... I know that an actual charge attack plays out a little different than non-charging attacks regarding the questions above. Not exactly. Primary and secondary attacks mostly refer to the "skill level" of a natural attack. Primary attacks tend to use full bonuses, while secondary attacks tend to have a -5 penalty to attack and only add half Str bonus to damage. However, and perhaps not pertaining to these questions, when creatures with natural attacks start using manufactured weapons and natural attacks together, all their natural attacks (primary & secondary) are treated as secondary attacks. Regardless of whether a creature is using manufactured and/or natural weapons, you pretty much almost always need to take a full-round action to make more than one attack on your turn (whether it is two-weapon fighting, full attack from a high base attack bonus, flurry of blows, multiple natural weapons, etc). Using a standard action to make an attack is just for making one attack. The only exception that comes to mind is using a standard action to Cleave, which is still technically one swing but using a feat to make it potentially hit more than one target. In summary, a creature must use a full-round action to take a full attack, which lets it attack with all its natural weapons. And yep, pounce is another exception. |
|
|
|
Post by Rabbit on Mar 1, 2014 13:26:30 GMT -5
That all sounds good. And I wanted to add this link just so it's on the board. I know it's not an official resource (and it tends to reference ALL the books/feats/alternate options), but it does go through a lot of the basics and some commonly dealt with aspects of Summoners and their Eidolons. www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=184592 |
|
|
|
Post by reefwood on Mar 3, 2014 18:21:01 GMT -5
Everyone gains 3 levels and 30,000 gp, which brings most of you to 9th-level and gives everyone a total wealth of 46,000 gp each. No more than 25% (11,500 gp) can be spent on a single item, and currently owned items can be sold at half price.
Each PC begins play with 1 hero point.
Just so everyone has a better idea of how far this mini-campaign will go, which may influence your build, this is the progression I have in mind:
Adventure #3 (Apr) - Level 9
Adventure #4 (May) - Level 10
Adventure #5 (Jun) - Level 12
Adv #3 will be a diplomatic mission of sorts, but there will be a combat/physical component linked to the negotiations, and there will be times when the party will be split up (and also times when it may be advantageous to do so), so be prepared not have access to everyone's goodies all the time (or even anyone else's at times).
Adv #4 will involve seeking out a location (i.e. pharaoh tomb in desert, sacred cave in mountain range, etc) and present a mix of combat and puzzles.
Adv #5 will probably be combat-heavy but also involve keeping low-key.
If we can get together for a 6th adventure, it will be level 15. Wowzers!
|
|
|
|
Post by icnivad on Mar 3, 2014 19:44:15 GMT -5
Cool.
Realized while leveling up that armor training that Taj already has negates his armor slowness, so his speed should be 30, not 20.
and I have a question about a feat:
I don't see any reason why this wouldn't work with Whirlwind, or Attacks of Opportunity, but I figured I'd check.
Also, Could I find a belt of strength and dex? each at +2 should be 8000gp total. Or is there a way to have one of them in a different slot?
|
|
|
|
Post by reefwood on Mar 3, 2014 21:58:29 GMT -5
Cool. Realized while leveling up that armor training that Taj already has negates his armor slowness, so his speed should be 30, not 20. and I have a question about a feat: I don't see any reason why this wouldn't work with Whirlwind, or Attacks of Opportunity, but I figured I'd check. Also, Could I find a belt of strength and dex? each at +2 should be 8000gp total. Or is there a way to have one of them in a different slot? Good to know about the armor training. Lunge works with Whirlwind Attack, and it would work with AoOs on your turn (i.e. when you trip on your turn) but not for AoOs after your turn. There is a belt of physical might that provides +2 to two physical ability scores as well as a headband of mental prowess that provides +2 to two mental ability scores. Both cost 10,000 gp. |
|
|
|
Post by icnivad on Mar 3, 2014 22:37:17 GMT -5
Oh, yeah. After reading carefully that makes total sense. I should have caught that wording.
|
|
|
|
Post by icnivad on Mar 3, 2014 23:11:25 GMT -5
Also, I picked up a Wand of Infernal Healing (fast healing 1 for 1 minute). The spell is from the Inner Sea Guide. Heals 10 HP per casting vs cure light wounds which only heals ~5.5. If anyone else wants to pick up some bulk healing, this is probably the way to go. The downside is that it is an [evil] spell. Although none of us are good, so meh.
|
|
|
|
Post by icnivad on Mar 4, 2014 2:14:27 GMT -5
PS: Players: We chatted about spending a point for a Sign Language. Do we want to do this?
Reefwood: We thought it might be cool if there was a sign language invented by the pathfinder society. Are you ok with us spending a skill point to learn this?
|
|
|
|
Post by Rabbit on Mar 4, 2014 18:56:00 GMT -5
PS: Players: We chatted about spending a point for a Sign Language. Do we want to do this? Reefwood: We thought it might be cool if there was a sign language invented by the pathfinder society. Are you ok with us spending a skill point to learn this? Provided reefwood approves I would be down with everyone learning a "Pathfinder Sign Language" so we can communicate silently.  |
|
|
|
Post by reefwood on Mar 7, 2014 14:01:32 GMT -5
Also, I picked up a Wand of Infernal Healing (fast healing 1 for 1 minute). The spell is from the Inner Sea Guide. Heals 10 HP per casting vs cure light wounds which only heals ~5.5. If anyone else wants to pick up some bulk healing, this is probably the way to go. The downside is that it is an [evil] spell. Although none of us are good, so meh. I don't have my book handy to double check but saw online that a dose of unholy water is a material component, so that could make this spell more expensive. I think a dose of holy/unholy water is 25 gp, so if it applies, that amount would be added to the cost of every charge of the wand. Although, it does provide more healing and a guaranteed amount (as opposed to random roll), so that would be worth the extra expensive. One other thing to note, though, is that it doesn't heal every kind of damage. But I'll post again about this when I'm home. PS: Players: We chatted about spending a point for a Sign Language. Do we want to do this? Reefwood: We thought it might be cool if there was a sign language invented by the pathfinder society. Are you ok with us spending a skill point to learn this? Yeah, this is fine. |
|
|
|
Post by reefwood on Mar 17, 2014 13:55:31 GMT -5
Re: Infernal HealingSpells usually list the price of a material component if you have to pay separately for the material component, but this spell lists no price of the unholy water. Although, there is at least one spell that requires an expensive material component without listing the price - transformation requires a potion of bull's strength - the item is listed in the component line without a price. My guess is that no price is listed because it is easy to figure out the price of a potion. Whereas, something like a piece of onyx has no set price because the price will vary depending on its on size, so it specifically lists the price/size you need to cast animate dead (at least 25 gp per HD). Unholy water is an item with a set price and amount (25 gp per 1 lb flask). One strange thing is that the amount required by infernal healing spell is 1 dose, and "dose" really isn't an official rules term or amount. Also, adding 25 gp to every casting would make it expensive...which I thought might be too much for a 1st-level spell, but then I saw that bless water and curse water (which create holy water and unholy water) are also 1st-level spells.* And at 1st-level, infernal healing will always provide more healing than cure light wounds - if you did 8 castings of each and rolled a different number (1-8) on cure light wounds, it would be a difference of 80 hp infernal healing vs 44 hp cure light wounds. Even if you somehow rolled an 8 for each cure light wounds, it would still max out at 72 hp. Of course, one trade-off is that infernal healing works slower (1 hp per round for 10 rd), and I just saw that it has a casting time of 1 round (even as a wand**), so that also takes longer than the standard action of cure light wounds. Anyway, since this is really just being looked at as a way to heal more hit points than normal, and the potential downsides (evil aura, slower heal time) probably won't ever have an impact, I am going to say an added expense makes sense for this campaign, so the unholy water does have a price of 25 gp per casting of this spell, so that would be 1,250 gp for 50 charges in a wand. Added to the 750 gp price of a 1st-level wand brings the total to 2,000 gp. That is 2.3% of 9th-level wealth, so not much to pay for 500 hit points of healing. *On a side note, it's strange that holy/unholy water only costs 25 gp. It seems like they should cost 50 gp because at 25 gp, the person selling it doesn't make any money and technically isn't even charging for actual casting (just the material component). But who knows, maybe temples in the fantasy world are non-profits  **Can a spell cast from a wand be disrupted? Using a wand does not provoke an attack of opportunity, but that's not the same thing. Also, a wand says it can be used by while grappling, but you can cast a spell while grappling too - just need to make a Concentration check. Not that you will likely be disrupted if you just use this wand out of combat, but just curious about this (if wands can be disrupted) in general.
Re: Whirlwind AttackI'm still looking into this, but for the time being, just assume my initial ruling stands. Also, giving it more thought this morning, I wonder if what Taj is wanting to do with this feat - attack with 5-ft weapon (spikes) and reach weapon (horsechopper) - is just an unanticipated quirk that no one thought to specifically rule out. Because this feat lets you make one attack per creature in reach, but under most circumstance, having multiple weapons would not change your reach. That's the main thing I'm looking at - that this attack is based on the range of a single weapon, not every weapon you may be wielding...in part because usually wielding multiple wepaons does not change your reach options. For example... Holding a longsword in one hand and a dagger in the other hand would be two weapons but both are at the 5-ft reach; no change in reach options when compared to only wielding one of these weapons. Holding a long longspear in one hang and a dagger in the other hand would be two weapons, but you can't use the longspear with one hand, so you can only attack with the dagger at a 5-ft reach; no change in reach options because you need both hands to use the longspear for 10-ft reach, which would mean losing the 5-ft reach of the dagger. Armor spikes are different because you don't need hands to wield the spikes, but it also seems like this is one of those rarely used items that the creators just didn't bother to consider when writing up the wordage of this feat. Whirlwind Attack sort of seems like a more guaranteed version of Great Cleave - you attack every creature in range with one weapon (as opposed to having to hit each time to continue the attack AND needing the opponents to be next to each other) and don't take the AC penalty, so I do see it as using one weapon to make one really long attack. Even going back to the longsword in one hand and dagger in the other hand, changing the weapons to longsword and club...the reach is the same, but it could matter if you were fighting a mix of creatures, some of which had DR 5/slashing and DR 5/bludgeoning. I can see the importance of being limited to 1 weapon, and selecting the weapon would just depend which group you wanted to damage more... similar to having 2 reach options, you just have to decide who you want to damage. Another very important thing to note is the last line of this feat where you "forfeit any bonus or extra attacks granted by other feats, spells, or abilities." This would negate the bonuses from Improved Trip and Greater Trip as well as any special Fighter abilities like the bonus to weapon groups. I can see how it makes sense that when you are spinning around super fast, you lose the ability to avoid attacks of opportunity when tripping, you lose the bonuses to the attack roll, and you can't trip with the same skill to make the tripped target provoke attacks of opportunity. We handled this wrong last time, but live and learn.
|
|
|
|
Post by reefwood on Mar 17, 2014 14:19:23 GMT -5
Another thing to mention is that I do gear challenges toward the strengths and weaknesses of the PCs. I usually do like to toss in at least one thing the party may not be prepared to handle, but most challenges are within the party's ability to tackle, and sometimes a great or terrible roll can really sway things unintentionally. For example, the undead battle in Adventure #2 was pretty much what I expected. It's partially a matter of strategy, so Elana casting silence and Taj getting into the thick of things were good ways to tackle this. But there is also the semi-random factor that comes with rolling, so PCs falling under the trance and getting paralyzed happened too. However, the foes weren't hard to hit and didn't have many hit points, so it was also sort of a race of taking them out before there were too many chances for the worse things to happen. If Taj could hit every creature in 5-ft and 10-ft reach with a single attack, they would have been tougher.
Semi-related, this campaign is designed to make it easy for players to change characters, and these are tough adventures, so I half-expect at least one PC to die each session. We never got to the really dangerous combat in Adventure #1, so I wasn't able to see how that measured up, but Adventure #2 almost led to PC death, so that worked out how I wanted.
|
|
|
|
Post by icnivad on Mar 18, 2014 17:40:41 GMT -5
Noted. thanks.
|
|
|
|
Post by reefwood on Mar 31, 2014 12:54:47 GMT -5
icnivad...is Taj taking the Combat Patrol feat? I wasn't sure if you were just considered it or set on it? It looks to be much more involved once I read the entire description, so I want to make sure we are on the same page and maybe see if there is any clarifying info about it out there.
At first, I thought this somehow increased reach, kind of like Lunge, but it didn't really make sense how someone with a 5-ft reach could melee attack a creature 20 ft away, but now see that it is actually about increasing threatened area, not reach, which makes more sense, and it does this by providing new movement rules.
From what I read, if you have BAB +10, you threaten an area of 15 ft around you instead of 5 ft (or 20 ft with a reach weapon instead of 10 ft). If a creature in this area provokes an attack of opportunity, you can attack them as long as you can move to reach them. If your speed is 30 ft, you can spend up to 30 ft moving to make attacks until the start of your next turn, and this movement provokes attack of opportunities from others. Once you move your speed, you can no longer move to make attacks of opportunity, but you can still make regular attacks of opportunity that are within your normal reach. This all seems cut and dry to me.
One thing that is perhaps not totally clear is whether your increased threatened area is based on your location at the start of your turn, or if it changes every time you move. This feat doesn't say anything about having to return to your starting location, so I would guess that is not required, and it seems to make the most sense that every time you move, your threatened area changes based on where you stop to make the attack.
Another thing is that this feat doesn't outline are any restrictions on movement. For example, do you have to stop where you make the attack, or can you move after the attack too (like Spring Attack)? Also, can you only move within the threatened area, or can you move outside this area to reach the target? And do you have to move in the most direct path to the target, or can you move in a round about way?
The last thing is that I'm not sure how/if this would work with Lunge. Lunge only applies to attacks during your turn, not to attacks of opportunity after your turn. Your turn in Combat Patrol is essentially spent getting ready move to attack when the opportunity arises, then your turn ends, and then you are able to add movement to your attacks of opportunity if targets provoke, but the turn ending is when Lunge would end, so I'd say the two feats cannot work together. They are both ways to make melee attacks farther than normal but do not stack.
|
|
|
|
Post by Rabbit on Apr 11, 2014 18:15:34 GMT -5
Hmm, this is great news about the approval of the Pathfinder's Lodge, but I doubt we've seen the last of our trials in these cursed orc lands... Just spit-balling here but I'm tempted to build a Cavalier with the Leadership feat (potentially a 7th level cohort and five 1st level grunts.) Build a unit of Pathfinder 'soldiers' with teamwork feats to escort these heroes through the bad lands. |
|
